Let's Think About It Podcast

Episode 65: Reframing Fear: From “Why Me?” to “Why Not Me?”

• Morice Mabry • Season 3 • Episode 65

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Episode Summary

Coach Mo reconnects with longtime friend and consultant Robynne Rose-Haymer for a conversation that blends personal truth with practical strategy. Robynne shares how mindfulness, gratitude, and a strong support squad help her navigate life’s peaks and valleys while refusing to let fear or the inner critic dictate her path. From doctoral studies to nonprofit leadership, she brings a lived perspective on resilience, reflection, and continuous learning. Coach Mo then introduces his S.W.A.G.™ framework—Self-awareness, Why-power, Aligned Action, and Grit—as a proven structure leaders can use to take small daily steps that add up to lasting growth. Together, they outline a recipe for shifting from self-doubt into momentum, reminding us that fear is often “false evidence appearing real” and that true leadership begins with vision and self-awareness.

Key Takeaways 

  • Mindfulness as a superpower: Daily breathing, gratitude, and self-reflection recalibrate energy in valleys.
  • Reframe fear: Replace “Why me?” with “Why not me?” and treat fear as False Evidence Appearing Real.
  • Continuous learning mindset: Curiosity and reflection open doors to growth when resources and answers aren’t obvious.
  • S.W.A.G.™ framework (Coach Mo): Build Self-awareness, connect to Why-power, take Aligned Action, and cultivate Grit to stay on course.
  • Detours ≠ derailment: Like MapQuest, knowing your starting and ending point helps you reroute with confidence when life shifts.
Speaker 1:

Welcome to the let's Think About it podcast, where we embark on a journey of thoughtfulness and personal growth. I'm your host, Coach Mo, and I'm here to guide you through thought-provoking discussions that will inspire you to unlock your full potential. In each episode, we'll explore a wide range of topics, from self-discovery and mindfulness to goal-setting and achieving success. Together, we'll challenge conventional thinking and dive deep into the realms of possibility. Whether you're looking to find clarity in your personal or professional life, or seeking strategies to overcome obstacles, this podcast is your go-to source for insightful conversations and practical advice. So find a comfortable spot, chill and let's embark on this journey of self-improvement together. Remember, the power of transformation lies within you, and together we'll uncover the tools and insights you need to make it happen. So let's dive in. Welcome to another episode of the let's Think About it podcast. I'm your host, Coach Mo, and I'm here with another amazing guest, my longtime friend, Robin Rose Hamer. What's up? How you doing?

Speaker 2:

I'm doing great. I am super glad that we were able to connect. It has been a roller coaster with these schedules, but we are here now and I am happy about it.

Speaker 1:

I don't think our audience know how far we go back, so would you give them the privilege to let our audience know how far do we go back?

Speaker 2:

I think one of the things that we are both extremely grateful for is we go back before social media, and I know there are things in your life and mine that we are so incredibly glad that it was not possible to Snapchat or TikTok or record. We didn't even have recording devices. We have been rocking since 1990.

Speaker 1:

That is true, and we may have fallen off the grid here and there, but every time and building businesses and all of that that we could stay connected virtually.

Speaker 2:

And so for that I am grateful for both Facebook and LinkedIn, because I get to stay connected to you in that way, absolutely.

Speaker 1:

Robin, tell us who you are, what you and the value that you bring to others.

Speaker 2:

Oh, mo, okay. So who I am first is a mother of three amazing, wonderful, tremendously great humans who are now adults, and the grandmother, if I could be so bold, of two amazing humans. So that's my reason for being my raison d'etre is my children and grandchildren. And I am also a student. I am a doctoral student at the University of San Francisco studying education, and I am a full-time consultant in this world of political strategy and professional development. And in my spare time it's really important for me to sit on nonprofit boards, so I am providing board service to four organizations. I also really enjoy a good glass of wine, so I also am a wine drinker wine, so I also am a wine drinker.

Speaker 1:

Wow, thank you. Because this platform we focus on helping people get out of their own damn way. Dealing with that punk as inner critic. You mentioned consulting around professional development. I'm going to have to pick your brain a little bit to help my audience. I know your journey's been long and it's been a fascinating journey. I can assume, and I know, you had some peaks and some valleys. So take us through your process and when you hit those valleys, how does the inner credit typically shows up for you and how do you deal with it? How do you navigate it? What's your strategy?

Speaker 2:

I love this question for a lot of reasons, because it builds on the previous ask, which is what value do I bring? Peaks and valleys are common and I think starting with that mindset helps to be able to navigate them. People who are surprised by peaks and valleys, those are the folks that, in my experience, have the most difficult journey, because we shouldn't be surprised that we have highs and lows. I had highs and lows today, let alone over this career. I have learned that mindfulness is a superpower and being present with myself and being very attuned to what are the signals and signs for my body Like? Am I hearing from my gut? Am I hearing from my heart? Am I hearing from my head? What do each of those things mean? And, honestly, it starts by having a good plan.

Speaker 2:

You talk about a journey and I frequently tell people MapQuest, which I know is not how people find their way places anymore. But bear with me. Mapquest requires you to have a starting location and an ending location and knowledge of streets and routes and traffic. If you do not have an exact beginning location and do not have an exact ending location, you're going to end up somewhere, but probably not in the place that you were hoping to go. So having goals helps to calibrate those directions and helps to calibrate when you get veered off course.

Speaker 2:

When there are detours in life, at least you have a way to reroute and you can keep your eye on where you intend to go. So when valleys come, I engage in a few strategies If it's a temporary setback, mindful breathing, just to make sure that I'm in control of the only thing that I am in situations, which is me, and then follow that up with. Everybody needs to complain, cry, rant, rail. So having a good squad also helps to be able to navigate the valleys, because people who know you and care about you and are interested in your journey and your goals, those folks are the people that you can go back to and they can help you find your way again, help you remember your purpose. And then I think the last and most important thing is like a structured way of being. So every day, before I hit the floor, I say prayer, I remember what I am grateful for, and gratitude has gotten me through many of this conversation with.

Speaker 2:

I am always better six feet over than six feet under, and there are people who didn't wake up this morning, and so for that I have another opportunity, another shot at getting this right and achieving this goal, and so being very clear, about which I am grateful, is another way that I navigate those valleys.

Speaker 1:

How did you generate the awareness to develop mindfulness? Because most people we're just on autopilot and they're just going through life, but there's an aspect of mindfulness that you have to have some sort of awareness to think mindfulness. So where did that come from for you?

Speaker 2:

Listen, when you beat your head on the same wall a whole bunch of times and then when you back up your head, you get ready to hit your head one more time and you notice there's a spot and you start to investigate, like why is there a spot? And you start to investigate like why is there a spot on the wall where I always hit my head? And then finally it dawns on you that doing the same thing over and over again is the definition of insanity.

Speaker 2:

That's where mindfulness began for me. So it wasn't a huge revelation. There were no angels that appeared or a star. I was sick and tired of being sick and tired. I had to start thinking OK, so the only thing in these situations that don't work out for you, the only commonality, robin, is you. So maybe you need to do something different to make sure that some of the rest of these things fall into line, and so self-realization only matters if you are getting ready to engage in action. Right, so there's the realization part.

Speaker 2:

But then you have to do something, and that doesn't always happen like bang, like one right after the other, and it was slow going for me. And that happens because I was focused on kids, I was focused on family, I was focused on just putting one foot in front of the other, and survival in those cases is way more important than self-actualization. An opportunity to sit with yourself in those quiet places and you realize that you're not where you want to be and you start to reflect on how you've gotten to this place that you are in life. It requires some recalibration, and that's where that goal setting starts, right In the quiet, self-reflective moments, and it starts with what do I want? Where do I want to be? How am I going to get there? Comes way after the figuring out what I want.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I like that word reflection and coming from our backgrounds, that's not taught. You go through life, you just experience it. No one teaches you how to have self-awareness, or at least I wasn't taught to have self-awareness. I wasn't taught to effectively think through things. I was the first in my generation to go to college and so while we were at college, figuring it out as we go, but I think, to reiterate your point, banging your head on the wall, doing the same thing over and over, that was me right. I was thinking to myself why do I keep doing this to myself? Why does this happen to me? And then I'm looking at the next person in which I'm thinking I'm better than that person, I'm more knowledgeable than that person. You get in these moments at least I would get in these moments and I would have self-pity about myself. But during that self-pity process at a younger age, I was asking myself why, how do I find out more? How do I do this? How do I do that? And it wasn't for me.

Speaker 1:

I think it was like 2010,. I hit a point where me and my wife was coming back from our vacation our first year anniversary and I get the pink slip and that just like dropped me. That was a gut shot. That hit me because me, robin, I've always been that guy that's always trying to strive and be the best version of myself and in that moment I didn't understand how could something like that happen to me? Why me?

Speaker 1:

And then I went into this pity mode and then, for me, that's how I was discovered. I discovered coaching, because this coach started working with me and I was just like, oh, my goodness, wow, this is great. And she pulled me out of this rut. And I think that's the key right, because as we navigate through our lives, there's always two sides of the coin. There's the worst case scenario and the best case scenario. We naturally focus on worst case scenario. So when things hit the fan, we go into this worst case scenario mode that promotes avoidance, that promotes stay away, don't touch that. But the growth actually happens, naturally when you go through the fear, when you approach it, when you challenge the inner critic, and so, over a duration of time, you learn to flip it. Why me to? Why not me? You feel me.

Speaker 2:

I do and I appreciate really the framing because you use the word growth and that's always been important to me as an educator. You use the word growth and that's always been important to me as an educator. Having a growth mindset versus a scarcity mindset puts you in a position to receive, puts you in a position to learn, gives you the desire to be a continuous learner, and that's how you buck yourself out of a bad situation, right, like. However you got to that situation, you're not going to get out from what you were doing, so you have to do something different. So it requires recalibration, it maybe requires some new tools and, to your point, like you met with a coach and that sparked your thought about maybe I should be a coach Now.

Speaker 2:

Mo, I've known you a long time. You were an athlete when I met you, so you knew a lot about coaching and you knew a lot of coaches. So even then you were coachable but you hadn't really made the leap into coaching. You had to get situationally pushed into an arena that you were uncomfortable and, to use your words, experiencing some fear about maybe what was going to happen with your family. And then you were like, wait a minute, I do have these skills. I do know how this works. I have had this experience.

Speaker 2:

So that's the other thing that helps me is when I start to feel fear, I remember it's false evidence appearing real.

Speaker 2:

So fear oftentimes is masked as like this big, scary thing, when in fact all it is a bunch of untruths that your inner critic has told yourself or some other rude, uncaring person whose opinion about you shouldn't matter anyway, and that is what weighs us down.

Speaker 2:

So I will tell you another way that I've gotten through and it has helped as I've aged, and that is knowing that what other people think of me is really none of my business Damn business man. That is mind blowing, because when you are freed from the opinions of everyone else and listen, I had a mama who had lots of opinions, so it was hard to get freed from those opinions. I have friends who have lots of opinions. It was hard to get freed from those opinions, but once I gave myself permission to say, their opinion belongs to them and that's fine. But what I think of me and what I want for myself and what I need is the most important thing. That's where you know true success. That's where peaks started to happen, was when I realized that I defined who I was and what I needed and how I should get there.

Speaker 1:

That's powerful, right. The reality is people are worried about how they damn about you and what you got going on. But we think other people is worried about what we got going on, and that is so not true. And the other thing is we naturally carry these judgments about ourselves and I call them these energy blocks, right, the limiting beliefs, the interpretations, the assumptions, the inner critic. It's all flawed.

Speaker 1:

But then you tie your voice to the judgment that's in your mind and that inner critic is talking and it sounds like you, it's believable, it sounds so real and you listen to it. And each time it limits you, it talks you out of what's really important. God gives us the spirit, or the universe, whoever you believe in. You have this spirit inside of you and we all do. We have it and it's guiding us, it's telling us man, here's an idea, try this. And then that voice, that inner critic, the people going to think, if I do this, x and Y right, and you totally just avoid it, dismiss it, don't try, for whatever the judgment is that you carry, and then you wonder why things haven't shifted for you, because we've all are blessed with certain spirits that's trying to guide us. You can't be guided if you're consistently distracted by the limiting beliefs that you're carrying.

Speaker 2:

That's true, and until we achieve the next step to get to what is for us, we're going to be in the same place. And I think what you're saying is how I've felt and how I've coached and case managed and supported people, and that is you don't win the whole race the first day you start training. There's levels to this, and so if you have a goal, just because you didn't achieve it in day one, doesn't mean that goal is not for you. It means you have to prepare yourself. You have to get your mind, your body, your spirit all in alignment to be ready to receive that which is for you, and so I really appreciate your uplifting of that spirit that's within us.

Speaker 2:

One of my favorite poems is that Marianne Williamson poem. Right Like the idea that we are all meant to shine, there is no dullness in any of us, and so if we lean in and discover and get curious and do the work, we can find it, we can achieve it, and it isn't by any means simple. The more huge, the more epic your goal is, the harder it is to achieve, but when you align yourself to your vision, it gets a lot easier your vision, it gets a lot easier.

Speaker 1:

It does, because that vision is the picture. We think in pictures and if we don't learn how to train our mind to formulate the pictures, it's hard to get that desired outcome because there's no picture to go after, right. But if you have the picture, the image, and you feel it, you know how it would feel once I get that. Whatever that image is right Now, you're emotionally connected to the image. So now, when the voice comes, the inner critic starts sharing that you should stop, you should quit, you shouldn't do this and this it's easier to dismiss it, it's easier to challenge it, because you got this image right in your right, in your forefront, that you're going after and I'm not going to let anything stop me from achieving it. And I tell this to a lot of my clients think about it when you really wanted something did you get it. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, a hundred percent of the time. I think you are speaking my language, mostly because I love to nerd out on adult learning theory, and so this idea of scaffolding, right Like this idea of attaching what you need to know to what you already know, is vitally important in adult learning. And so this picture description that you created actually can come in a variety of different forms. It can be icons, it can be a mug, a saying on a mug. I wanted to go to France. I wanted to go to France so bad, so I just started buying everything with Eiffel Towers on it. My screensaver was an Eiffel Tower and then I started saving money to go to France, and then I started planning a trip with my friends to go to France. So I was able to see it to your point and then align my life and my vision to be able to evidence it, that tangible reminder of a goal.

Speaker 1:

It's huge, it's gigantic. And I was doing this, not knowing I was doing this, at an early age, because part I remember my vision was I want to play college football.

Speaker 2:

And during that time, I was there, you did it.

Speaker 1:

I did it right. But we all came in together and it was just a large group of players and things like that and people start falling off. But I stuck to my vision. I was like, no, I'm not quitting regardless. And we're talking like early 90s, right? So there was some racism and stuff like that going on at Davis and all of that crazy stuff.

Speaker 2:

But no scholarships.

Speaker 1:

Yes, no, scholarships, everything was financial aid, getting the extra loans and stuff like that. But I had that image that, no, this is what I want to do and I did it and that's with anything in our lives. And I think we lose sight of that because faith as a whole is so hard to see the unseen in your faith wavers, because you can't see the unseen within us. Whatever that picture is working towards that picture and we can't see it working towards that picture. So because we can't see the inner workings that's moving us towards the picture, we lose belief.

Speaker 2:

And that's true. You mentioned that we don't know what we don't know, and that Johari window is the thing that gets so many adults, because we start to harm ourself, because we reject anything that we didn't know, that we didn't know, as not being true. And so that's another reason why being a continuous learner is so incredibly valuable and important to people with goals, because there's a lot of things we don't know, that we don't know. If we can at least expose ourselves to what's out there in the world, it provides us, to your point, a picture of okay, I know that I don't know how to fix a car, but now I know how to find an engine.

Speaker 2:

Ok, I know that I don't know how to fix a car, but now I know how to find an engine. So at least when I watch a YouTube video, I have some context about what I'm looking for. And now I've read the manual for my car and so I know where the oil goes. Now I've never been to an auto parts store and that's scary, but I'm going to go into the auto parts store with my new knowledge that I know what kind of oil that my car takes and I know where it goes. So now I can go into the auto parts store and feel confident that I can ask for help, because there are so many people who don't feel like they're competent enough to even ask for help, which is why your job is so important Exactly.

Speaker 1:

But we're in an environment where there's so many resources. Now you've got chat, gpt, ai that's surpassing the search engines, so you can just ask the AI a certain question and I can create a foundation approach, just a foundation to start the journey of creating a vision. Whatever that looks like, you can leverage it from that viewpoint. I don't know what I need to do or what's next for me. You could type in this is where I am in my life, Give me some recommendations, what should be some next steps for me, and just start there. Just start there.

Speaker 2:

That's it, asking questions. But see, that's developing a spirit of curiosity, that's being a continuous learner. So I think if we were lining up right, like our playbook, you and me, it's time for us to start creating this recipe. First thing is get curious.

Speaker 2:

Don't get depressed, don't quit, be curious about what comes next and then gather information. And you don't have to take everything at face value To your point about chat GPT. Sure, ask it, but then you better ask for some backup resources or references, because chat GPT is not 100% right either. Right, it was created by people. So you need to make sure that you're doing your due diligence Exactly. The information or direction that you've been given is right. Like how many times has somebody given you directions to someplace and you're like let me just check with Google Maps and make sure exactly how they misremembered that last turn. I was supposed to go left instead of go, and if you go right, when you're supposed to go left, it takes you a long time to get back around that block. So, confirming the directions and then start figuring out what resources you need, right, you don't have to have them all at once, but at least knowing what your goal is.

Speaker 2:

When I was planning to go to France, in my mind it was this huge, unobtainable number, and when we started planning I was like, oh, I can do that in a year and a half. And so then I started saving. But right, as long as it's something that I can't conceive of. I can't see it. Then it becomes impossible. So we're putting together a pretty good recipe mom.

Speaker 1:

The other thing is I teach this framework is swag. Get your swag back and it's really. People may think of it as confidence, but it is. That's the element of swag. But the swag that I teach the framework of it is self-awareness understanding that inner critic, having a vision, goals, all of that, your values. That creates self-awareness.

Speaker 1:

Why power? Your purpose, why am I doing what I'm doing? It's just that simple. Why power? And then there's the aligned action. Okay, you identify your purpose, you know what actions. Right now, one action that's going to propel me forward towards my overall goal You're taking these baby steps and over time, that cultivates into larger steps and when you look around, you turn your head and look back you didn't walk the mile. That's aligned action. What can I do today that's going to propel me forward to create my tomorrow? And then, finally, grit Having the determination to not quit on your version of what success looks like, regardless of what people think. And if you have swag, self-awareness, why power? Aligned action and grit, you'll get to your goal. You'll get to that vision Because, at the end of the day, when you look back, I don't care who you are and there's something that you really wanted swag was present.

Speaker 2:

A hundred percent. And I love the analogy and the inference because I think that whole concept of fake it till you make it was like the beginning part of swag right. How many times have we heard if you are feeling bad, get up, take a shower, put your clothes on and get out. Don't just sit in the house, don't just lay around and not brush your teeth Like you got to get up and get moving because two things a body in motion stays in motion, a body at rest stays at rest. So we got to go with the physics. But then the other part of that is what you said, and that is just take the first step right. The journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step. So to your point, you look behind you and you've walked a mile already and all you had to go was two.

Speaker 2:

So it's really important to get up and get started.

Speaker 1:

So, lastly, who are you serving what you do and how do you help people?

Speaker 2:

So I've always believed in the mantra to whom much is given, much is expected. And I've been given so much grace in my life and I am incredibly humbled by my positionality. And, as I mentioned, I sit on a few nonprofit boards. One of them is a nonprofit organization that serves young people in elementary schools it's an afterschool program and I serve in the capacity of providing technical support both to the nonprofit organization and also to the programming side. I am sitting on the board.

Speaker 2:

It's given me great pleasure to have worked with people who are experiencing homelessness over the past seven years, so I'm really grateful to get an opportunity to hear about what kind of research Kaiser is starting to work on and provide input. I have a really great opportunity to work with my leadership program and I'm currently serving as the president of our investment club. And that for me, mo, that was my stretch right. I didn't know anything about investing. I am very grateful to have sat as a student for a number of years and then be put in a position that my organizational gift, my gift of being able to help create positive organizations, has been uplifted in that space.

Speaker 2:

I also am a former member of the Benioff Housing and Homelessness Initiative at UCSF, a member of one of their lived expert boards, and in all of these spaces I'm super grateful because I realized that it's my job to hold the door open for somebody else. So I spent 18 years working for Elk Grove Unified School District as a job developer, and so anytime somebody I know needs a job they're like Robin, I know you got jobs Tell me where I can get a job, and I'm so happy to be able to share that knowledge with people, because most of the time it just sits in my inbox. Honestly, I was connecting people, so I do that a lot. I see myself as a connector and I see myself as a hub of information for people. So that's how I'm in service. That's awesome.

Speaker 1:

That's awesome, and how can our audience get a hold of you if they wanted to connect and take your offer on some of this information that you may have to share?

Speaker 2:

Absolutely. I'm a big LinkedIn user. I'm not big on any of the other socials, but find me on LinkedIn. My name is uniquely spelled. It's right there for you on the screen. I encourage you to reach out and definitely we'll tag all this information in the chat of the podcast when it comes out. The most important thing I want people to know is just to reach out. I love sharing information and I think it's really important. I focus on growth mindset right. So the more you know, the better we all are.

Speaker 1:

For our audio audience who can't see. How do you spell your name and find you on LinkedIn?

Speaker 2:

Sure, I'm Robin R-O-B-Y-N-N-E and my last name is Rose. Just like the flower R-O-S-E hyphen, great Y'all, non grammatically lovers, that's a dash. H-a-y-m-e-r. Robin Rose Hamer.

Speaker 1:

There it is. There it is. I appreciate you. Thank you for sharing your wisdom with me. I love this talk. I'm going to have to bring you on again. We're going to have to do this again because this went by too fast, but I really do appreciate you.

Speaker 2:

Thanks, Mo. I appreciate the opportunity. I'm so happy that the rest of the world gets to know the Mo that I've known for 35 years and, yeah, obviously I'd be happy to come back.

Speaker 1:

Thank you. Thank you for joining me in this episode of let's Think About it. Your time and attention are greatly appreciated. If you found value in today's discussion, I encourage you to subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Remember, the journey of self-improvement is ongoing and I'm here to support you every step of the way. Connect with me on social media for updates and insights. You can find me on Instagram and Facebook, at Coach Mo Coaching or LinkedIn, at Maurice Mabry, or visit my website at mauricemabrycom for exclusive content. Until next time, keep reflecting, keep growing and, most importantly, keep believing in yourself. Remember, the most effective way to do it is to do it together. We're making incredible strides toward a better and more empowered you, so thank you, and I'll see you in our next episode.